Thanks to Emma Quilter for some info on garlic. Hmmmmmm.......think the VAM/Hemoplex might be getting a workout here.
The Great Garlic Debate Dr. Karen Hayes, DVM, MS, discusses whether or not to feed your horse garlic as a feed supplement or fly repellent.
By Karen Hayes, DVM, MS
"It's heartening to see how passionate readers are about the care of their horses--and their garlic!
The toxic element in allium (a family of plants including both garlic and onions) is well known to be a chemical called N-propyl disulfide. By altering an enzyme present within the red blood cell, it depletes the cell of a chemical known as phosphate dehydrogenase (PD), whose job is to protect the cell from natural oxidative damage.
When the PD level gets low enough, the hemoglobin in the cell oxidizes and forms a "bubble" called a Heinz body on the outside of the cell--it's quite distinctive and readily seen under the microscope. The spleen--which acts as a red-cell "bouncer" of sorts--quickly removes the deformed cell from the bloodstream. As more and more red cells are prematurely damaged and removed, as will happen from consistent poisoning with N-propyl disulfide, your horse gradually becomes anemic. This is called Heinz-body anemia.
The "toxic dose" of N-propyl disulfide, which is not well worked out in any species, is the amount thought to cause obvious poisoning, a sort of "9-1-1" situation. Cows are thought to be more sensitive to the toxin than are horses, but in one study published in 1972 in the "Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association," the toxic dose in horses turned out to be considerably less than the 5 grams per kilogram of body weight reported in cows.
Here's what happened. When horses in a pasture dotted with wild onions came down with anemia (low red-blood-cell count), jaundice (increased bile pigments in the blood, causing yellowish discoloration of the gums and whites of the eyes), and reddish-colored urine, investigators decided to find out for sure whether onions had caused these symptoms.
To do so, they fed 1 pound of the onion tops per day to a healthy horse for 3 days, along with his regular feed, then 4 pounds on Day 4. From Day 4 through Day 8, his packed cell volume (or PCV, meaning his red-blood-cell percentage) dropped about 23 percent, from 30 to 23. The investigators continued to give the horse onion tops on Days 9 and 10; by Day 11, his PCV had dropped to a life-threatening 13--he'd lost almost 60 percent of his red blood cells in 11 days!
Most of us with a rudimentary interest in equine toxicology have no quarrel with this report, but what would've happened to pasture horses if they'd eaten smaller doses of the toxin? Good question--and here's where the controversy comes in.
Some vets say the toxic effects are more gradual and insidious--but still very real--when a lower dose is consumed on a regular basis, resulting in a mild anemia without obvious symptoms. This has been my experience in a practice. I see a handful of cases of Heinz-body anemia every year in horses that grazed on wild onions growing amidst the grass in their pastures, or helped themselves to discarded onions and leeks in the compost pile, or raided the garlic patch in the garden.
No well-designed, formal research has been conducted on the ill effects of lower doses of garlic on horses. But, to be fair, there also hasn't been any well-designed, formal research on the benefits of garlic in horses. For example, I've seen lots of horses reeking of garlic and crawling with flies, though garlic is reputed to be an effective fly repellent.
I've no doubt those of you who are feeding garlic to your horses are doing so because you want only the best for them--the best health and the highest degree of comfort. That's why I feel it's important for you to understand it isn't enough to say garlic is safe just because you haven't seen any ill effects in your garlic-supplemented horse. Depending on the dose, and the frequency and duration of dosing, there could be low-grade deleterious effects, due to red-blood-cell damage that's not enough to cause a 9-1-1 situation, but just enough to cause a mild anemia that might not be outwardly evident. It might affect your horse's stamina, energy level, or resistance to disease.
Until these suspicions are investigated and repudiated, how much risk are you willing to take? Until well-designed, formal research is done on garlic's risks and benefits, specifically in horses, it seems the only safe avenue is the avenue of caution. At the very least, I wanted each of you to make your decisions with benefit of all available information, including longstanding reports from researchers far greater than me, indicating that the popular garlic bulb has a dark side."
Sunday, September 30, 2007
Over the HILL & SNOT faraway ENOUGH!
Well the snot's really hitting the fan. The coughing horse is Roly, the elderly pony, next door. When he trots he coughs LOTS....but I can't decide if he has a chronic lung condition or if he's "full of you know what???". Might have to ring the neighbours.
The phone rang hot while I was feeding up doing obs. Obs which were, to a horse, very very normal. No coughing. Everyone fanging for food. Hotter day today, so temps a little above the average temp to date.
Keema - 37.8
Noah - 37.8
Paz - 37.8
Amazzon - 37.5
Bartie - 37.7
Frontier - 38
Lucky 37.8
Is this a slight elevation for all? Or is it the fact that we had a hotter day. Time will tell.
Yes, the phone..... Daphne Herman (over the road, over the hill) left a messsage & Carmen rang back to say yes, they were now definite members of the "snot trenches". Her well bred black ASH mare has a good amount of snot, all of them the cough. They are.... practically a neighbouring property.
Another message from the Bergmans - to say that their pony at the Sawmill on Lake Manchester Road has EI - & chasing drugs!
Still another from Merton, just 500m away, in need of drugs for a mare out at Glamorgan Vale who looks like she's got over the initial bout to develop a secondary infection.
Instructions and supplies of Bute and Bromotrimidine for the lot!
Hope that's it for tonight. Come on Keems, we have to get you foaled down! Maybe I NEED to go for the valium tonight.....the dog is definitely on the chain with an ACP tablet! Thanks Marty for working the afternoon on stopping him from getting under the house. We can't afford for him to chew the phone line in two.....he has slowly been destroying all the plastic related "lines" under the house...... Don't really need a dog with a plastic fetish at a time like this!
The phone rang hot while I was feeding up doing obs. Obs which were, to a horse, very very normal. No coughing. Everyone fanging for food. Hotter day today, so temps a little above the average temp to date.
Keema - 37.8
Noah - 37.8
Paz - 37.8
Amazzon - 37.5
Bartie - 37.7
Frontier - 38
Lucky 37.8
Is this a slight elevation for all? Or is it the fact that we had a hotter day. Time will tell.
Yes, the phone..... Daphne Herman (over the road, over the hill) left a messsage & Carmen rang back to say yes, they were now definite members of the "snot trenches". Her well bred black ASH mare has a good amount of snot, all of them the cough. They are.... practically a neighbouring property.
Another message from the Bergmans - to say that their pony at the Sawmill on Lake Manchester Road has EI - & chasing drugs!
Still another from Merton, just 500m away, in need of drugs for a mare out at Glamorgan Vale who looks like she's got over the initial bout to develop a secondary infection.
Instructions and supplies of Bute and Bromotrimidine for the lot!
Hope that's it for tonight. Come on Keems, we have to get you foaled down! Maybe I NEED to go for the valium tonight.....the dog is definitely on the chain with an ACP tablet! Thanks Marty for working the afternoon on stopping him from getting under the house. We can't afford for him to chew the phone line in two.....he has slowly been destroying all the plastic related "lines" under the house...... Don't really need a dog with a plastic fetish at a time like this!
Reporting In
As of today, in preparation for the EI onslaught, all Kholonial horses are up to date with trims and worming. Haven't heard of anymore advancements up the street.
Kalkadoon reported most horses showing signs today. Some pretty high temps but the bute is mostly keeping them comfortable, anything over 39C is getting flunixine. Everyone is pretty much still eating and all on the witch's brew - everyone has their own one. Kalkadoon swears by garlic particularly.
Over at Pullenvale at the Ryan's, Sonya measured the infected horses to actually be 480m away from hers with the GPS this morning. Still no sign of it in the Ryan paddock.
Jaimie rang with news of Beauzephalis from TE. Beau is comfortable, eating and drinking fine - the broodmares now look to be getting over it. They were the first paddock at TE to be affected. Jaimie expects Beau to foal within the next week or so. She did say that the broodmares have all been on TMPS as a precaution since day dot and though they were miserable they never went off their feed. Not alot of temp reduction was necessary in this group. Anything with a temp over 38.5 got treated. So don't think they used any flunixine in the about to foal mares, though was necessary in some of the mares that have a little bit more time to go.
The competition horses have shown no signs of EI at this stage. They've mostly all been vaccinated at one time or other.
Other hints or possible aids that they have used included immuno-stimulation therapy particularly in the competition horses, megacell (Vit E and selenium supplement recommended by KER) and garlic.
Sadaqa, who is 31 in January, hasn't had so much of a cough - and Jaimie attributes this largely to him being in the great health with the most amazing constitution. Also every possible aid/health supplement happening; Jaimie wondered about the virtues of the garlic.
I'll investigate the garlic theory as regards equines and report back. Any comments?
Another noticeable thing at TE is that although it is nearly through the Marburg property - there are paddocks that only seem to have one or two horses affected. The others must be but they seem to be holding the virus at a subclinical level and not getting any worse.
Also noticeable that when the horses "suffer" the virus the weight just drops off them so better to have horses in a little forward condition than not. The about to foal mares were in very good condition, but the virus knocked the "top" of them, just starting to recover and do better again.
Off to do afternoon obs. on this lot.
Kalkadoon reported most horses showing signs today. Some pretty high temps but the bute is mostly keeping them comfortable, anything over 39C is getting flunixine. Everyone is pretty much still eating and all on the witch's brew - everyone has their own one. Kalkadoon swears by garlic particularly.
Over at Pullenvale at the Ryan's, Sonya measured the infected horses to actually be 480m away from hers with the GPS this morning. Still no sign of it in the Ryan paddock.
Jaimie rang with news of Beauzephalis from TE. Beau is comfortable, eating and drinking fine - the broodmares now look to be getting over it. They were the first paddock at TE to be affected. Jaimie expects Beau to foal within the next week or so. She did say that the broodmares have all been on TMPS as a precaution since day dot and though they were miserable they never went off their feed. Not alot of temp reduction was necessary in this group. Anything with a temp over 38.5 got treated. So don't think they used any flunixine in the about to foal mares, though was necessary in some of the mares that have a little bit more time to go.
The competition horses have shown no signs of EI at this stage. They've mostly all been vaccinated at one time or other.
Other hints or possible aids that they have used included immuno-stimulation therapy particularly in the competition horses, megacell (Vit E and selenium supplement recommended by KER) and garlic.
Sadaqa, who is 31 in January, hasn't had so much of a cough - and Jaimie attributes this largely to him being in the great health with the most amazing constitution. Also every possible aid/health supplement happening; Jaimie wondered about the virtues of the garlic.
I'll investigate the garlic theory as regards equines and report back. Any comments?
Another noticeable thing at TE is that although it is nearly through the Marburg property - there are paddocks that only seem to have one or two horses affected. The others must be but they seem to be holding the virus at a subclinical level and not getting any worse.
Also noticeable that when the horses "suffer" the virus the weight just drops off them so better to have horses in a little forward condition than not. The about to foal mares were in very good condition, but the virus knocked the "top" of them, just starting to recover and do better again.
Off to do afternoon obs. on this lot.
No foal; no EI - the sequel
Someone coughed last night at 1:20am. Dreadful volley of coughs for several minutes. I sat straight up in bed. As it was I'd only just got to sleep after having a "word" to the Cattle Dog who was objecting to being on his chain. Checked out the window in the moonlight to see BOTH the stallion and Keema lying flat out. Thinking - OMG - they're both dead in my sleep haze. Keema does lie flat out for weeks prior to foaling.....needless to say she doesn't wear a foaling alarm.
Never did establish who it was, because didn't recur. Talk about frazzled nerves. I had rattled myself by reading accounts of EI on CBH - which in retrospect seemed worse than a horror movie. I'd since slept fitfully and dreamt all night of little red microscopic virus particles bombarding us from all directions.
All horses normal this morning. Keema looks similar to yesterday. Certainly not "sprung" and no signs of wax/milk.......
Steel Poppy this morning reports all nine Valley horses to be doing very well. Only one with any significant snot last evening and all with pretty near to normal temps. The cough expectorant - Exo Cough - also seems to be doing the job.
From Alamo (Fernvale on the Brisbane River) comes word that all 12 hors
es there have by this time now been infected with EI. The biggest bravest of them all seems to be taking it the hardest in Rupert aka Mario; lots of snot there! But all up no one too unwell after a week in the snot trenches, though everyone feeling extremely sorry for themselves (see pic above: photo credit Sue Crockett). Hopefully they're all on the mend there & no secondary infections.
Never did establish who it was, because didn't recur. Talk about frazzled nerves. I had rattled myself by reading accounts of EI on CBH - which in retrospect seemed worse than a horror movie. I'd since slept fitfully and dreamt all night of little red microscopic virus particles bombarding us from all directions.
All horses normal this morning. Keema looks similar to yesterday. Certainly not "sprung" and no signs of wax/milk.......
Steel Poppy this morning reports all nine Valley horses to be doing very well. Only one with any significant snot last evening and all with pretty near to normal temps. The cough expectorant - Exo Cough - also seems to be doing the job.
From Alamo (Fernvale on the Brisbane River) comes word that all 12 hors
es there have by this time now been infected with EI. The biggest bravest of them all seems to be taking it the hardest in Rupert aka Mario; lots of snot there! But all up no one too unwell after a week in the snot trenches, though everyone feeling extremely sorry for themselves (see pic above: photo credit Sue Crockett). Hopefully they're all on the mend there & no secondary infections. Saturday, September 29, 2007
Hanging on by the skin of our teeth!
Well today has been one of waiting really as the EI seems to have taken great bounds closer. Though it has been a still day. Hopefully no wind for the next week. All horses here well.
Temps this evening:
Keema - 37.6
Noah - 37.6
Pazzy - 37.5
Amazzon - 37.6
Bartie - 37.7
Lucky - 37.6
For those confused, yes, we do have more than six horses - just taking a couple of sentinel horses in the back paddocks!!!
All eating well, looking well, no nasal discharge, no coughing.....
Kalkadoon reports that EI in the stallions now, Maf-Ue Sultan sporting a temp and Ralvon Nevara around 40 - which sounds pretty up there to me. All ok though. Steel Poppy reports it definitely in all the valley horses now, but not back at the main house paddocks. Probably that Monty, SP index case, has had it for a few days now. So mild at first that it wasn't really tagged as EI.
Sonya rang to say that she was livid that the lady down the road hadn't let them know that EI was in the area - read about 100m down the road. Apparently they've had it for the best part of a week! Common courtesy appears to have flown out the window hand in hand with the infuriating privacy laws.
The Ryan horses still temping normal.....so far and haven't so much as cleared their throat!
Temps this evening:
Keema - 37.6
Noah - 37.6
Pazzy - 37.5
Amazzon - 37.6
Bartie - 37.7
Lucky - 37.6
For those confused, yes, we do have more than six horses - just taking a couple of sentinel horses in the back paddocks!!!
All eating well, looking well, no nasal discharge, no coughing.....
Kalkadoon reports that EI in the stallions now, Maf-Ue Sultan sporting a temp and Ralvon Nevara around 40 - which sounds pretty up there to me. All ok though. Steel Poppy reports it definitely in all the valley horses now, but not back at the main house paddocks. Probably that Monty, SP index case, has had it for a few days now. So mild at first that it wasn't really tagged as EI.
Sonya rang to say that she was livid that the lady down the road hadn't let them know that EI was in the area - read about 100m down the road. Apparently they've had it for the best part of a week! Common courtesy appears to have flown out the window hand in hand with the infuriating privacy laws.
The Ryan horses still temping normal.....so far and haven't so much as cleared their throat!
Two K's Away - two hills over
Can u believe it? Young Raymond Jones (Kholo Rd) has it in his horses & they haven't been off the property in 10 years. Straight across the river to his hill. That's it....bet we have elevated temps in the next few days......
OMG! It's on Skyline Drive, KHOLO
Apparently.......so about 5kms away south and about 7kms away north, probably about the same from a southeastern direction as well at Mt Crosby.......
Still No Foal; No EI
Living life with heavily pregnant mares and EI due at anytime.
This morning the girls are:
Keema 342 days (other foals: Day 344 & Day 349)
Pazzy 312 days (other foals: Day 339 & Day 344) see pic at right
No foal from Keema but didn't expect it. By the dates & previous experience it should be Mon-Fri next week. She usually waxes and gives plenty of warning in that regard, as does Paz. Paz got a good month to go. Both mares very experienced and in very good health.
All okay with paddocks out the back this morning. The stallion woke me galloping flat out around his front paddock, I could hear him 'rooting as he went....Still no sign of the dreaded EI. Haven't had any winds lately though....and that is how it has spread in all these cases mentioned.
The black cockatoos were in the pinetrees this morning. Screeching away, I always assoiciate them with good luck, though maybe that is the red-tail variety, we always see the yellow-tails. Whatever, we need alot of luck at the moment......
.....until this evening......
This morning the girls are:
Keema 342 days (other foals: Day 344 & Day 349)
Pazzy 312 days (other foals: Day 339 & Day 344) see pic at right
No foal from Keema but didn't expect it. By the dates & previous experience it should be Mon-Fri next week. She usually waxes and gives plenty of warning in that regard, as does Paz. Paz got a good month to go. Both mares very experienced and in very good health.
All okay with paddocks out the back this morning. The stallion woke me galloping flat out around his front paddock, I could hear him 'rooting as he went....Still no sign of the dreaded EI. Haven't had any winds lately though....and that is how it has spread in all these cases mentioned.
The black cockatoos were in the pinetrees this morning. Screeching away, I always assoiciate them with good luck, though maybe that is the red-tail variety, we always see the yellow-tails. Whatever, we need alot of luck at the moment......
.....until this evening......
Friday, September 28, 2007
Life in Lockdown
Today was the first day that I actually felt we have been fighting a losing battle. The headlines may as well read "Equine influenza on the rampage in South East Queensland."
We haven't got EI here at Kholonial yet but we are sure to shortly be enveloped in the thick sticky web insidiously wafting in on the breeze. It is terribly airborne going on what has happened in the last week. Never mind that its transmitted by fomites in an occassional big jump; it is the wind that is our worst enemy.
No respite for us. We have endurance horses, not TBs. Actually, we have one TB mare who might qualify for a vaccine should I say I want to breed her to a TB stallion this year. Which I was considering......but..... seems ludicrous to vaccinate her and not the others, many of whom would be many times her worth. We won't go there. Just one of the infuriating idiosyncrasies in this whole grotty saga.
Three of our closest friends/breeders have yesterday fallen victim to EI and all in quite separate locations.
Kalkadoon (Kalkadoon Performance Horses - 28 horses), very close to Marburg. Surrounded on all sides by EI but did have some distance b/w themselves and other horse properties, stuck up a valley a little out of the way. They had stuck it out for the best part of six weeks before succumbing. It showed, like it does all too frequently, in the mares in the back paddock. Three or four of them coughing in the morning mist, punctuated by the old retired gelding in the adjoining paddock.
Lanamere, (Arabians - 26 horses) located quite some distance away at Ferny View, left a message later that day. They also found it in their broodmares in an outer perimeter paddock. It had been in Glamorgan Vale, not 2 km away from them for nearly two weeks, and seemed like it had gone over and around them. Finally coming back to haunt them.
And lastly, yesterday Steel Poppy (Performance Horses - 27 horses) and I were confiding temperatures. I was concerned as I had an uncharacteristically high reading for one mare of 38.2. Up the valley there was one with 38.3 and a cough, but nothing else, no other temps. All normal. So neither of us worried.
That is until tonight.
More mares coughing up the valley and temps abound. We knew the horses at Banks Creek, several kilometres away were infected but thought it would take longer than that! They are roughly 7km up the valley from where we are, but who knows if anyone else along the valley has positives. I'm sure we'll soon know.
Here (Kholonial Performance Horses - 16 horses), just north of Ipswich, at Kholo..... the mare (Kholonial Amazzon) that temped at 38.2 yesterday, was tonight 38.1, no coughs. All very normal.
Three of our closest friends/breeders have yesterday fallen victim to EI and all in quite separate locations.
Kalkadoon (Kalkadoon Performance Horses - 28 horses), very close to Marburg. Surrounded on all sides by EI but did have some distance b/w themselves and other horse properties, stuck up a valley a little out of the way. They had stuck it out for the best part of six weeks before succumbing. It showed, like it does all too frequently, in the mares in the back paddock. Three or four of them coughing in the morning mist, punctuated by the old retired gelding in the adjoining paddock.
Lanamere, (Arabians - 26 horses) located quite some distance away at Ferny View, left a message later that day. They also found it in their broodmares in an outer perimeter paddock. It had been in Glamorgan Vale, not 2 km away from them for nearly two weeks, and seemed like it had gone over and around them. Finally coming back to haunt them.
And lastly, yesterday Steel Poppy (Performance Horses - 27 horses) and I were confiding temperatures. I was concerned as I had an uncharacteristically high reading for one mare of 38.2. Up the valley there was one with 38.3 and a cough, but nothing else, no other temps. All normal. So neither of us worried.
That is until tonight.
More mares coughing up the valley and temps abound. We knew the horses at Banks Creek, several kilometres away were infected but thought it would take longer than that! They are roughly 7km up the valley from where we are, but who knows if anyone else along the valley has positives. I'm sure we'll soon know.
Here (Kholonial Performance Horses - 16 horses), just north of Ipswich, at Kholo..... the mare (Kholonial Amazzon) that temped at 38.2 yesterday, was tonight 38.1, no coughs. All very normal.
Pregnant 24 yo mare Keema (aka Kemal Sweet Dreams pic above, note her crippled leg) was 37.6, due to drop her foal anytime, Day 341, but not tonight. Come on Keema foal, dang you before you get sick!
Arabian stallion Abrock Noah was 37.7
Other pregnant mare Cameo Apassionataa aka Pazzy 37.5, Day 311 - hang on for a while yet Paz.
With the last sentinel Little Bit of Luck aka Lucky (the TB) at 37.8.
No coughs, all healthy. How long can we last here?
Good friend Sonya rings from Pullenvale, hotspots of hotspots - suburb right next to Brookfield to tell me that finally the EI has arrived on her doorstep. It somehow took a giant leap over to Belbowrie, then worked its way back through the RDA, Moggill PC and up to the horses near the Pullenvale Hall. She's in a bit of a state. Her horses (three of them) have temped normal and no coughs, but the EI is about 500m up the road!
I can tell she's not handling the news well for she's letting her toddler watch Teenage Mutant Ninja turtles - a show way too violent for him. A toddler with destructive powers already akin to a tornado!
The silent creep is everywhere and the people in charge tell us its being transmitted by people. Not in one instance here. It doesn't lead to much confidence in the voice of the so-called "experts".
At this stage the infected horses are all in the mild onset stages. But I thought it incredibly co-incidental that this all could be happening on such a widespread scale, as I would think there is about 40km between/about one and all mentioned in this blog. It begs the question, where else? It is just blowing out exponentially. They will never get a buffer to work at this rate. Fingers crossed for the rest of the country they can.......
Also forgot to mention we do have an infected mare, she lives in the broodmare band at Toft Endurance. Needless to say I haven't been to see her but they assure me she is doing well. Due to foal this next week. And also another dry mare who may or may not be infected as we speak in a paddock next door to Lanamere. These mares have been super endurance horses of the past and produced some super foals. Neither are young, 21 and 24 respectively so hope they are not knocked around inadvertently....
Over and out for tonight the 28th September
Good friend Sonya rings from Pullenvale, hotspots of hotspots - suburb right next to Brookfield to tell me that finally the EI has arrived on her doorstep. It somehow took a giant leap over to Belbowrie, then worked its way back through the RDA, Moggill PC and up to the horses near the Pullenvale Hall. She's in a bit of a state. Her horses (three of them) have temped normal and no coughs, but the EI is about 500m up the road!
I can tell she's not handling the news well for she's letting her toddler watch Teenage Mutant Ninja turtles - a show way too violent for him. A toddler with destructive powers already akin to a tornado!
The silent creep is everywhere and the people in charge tell us its being transmitted by people. Not in one instance here. It doesn't lead to much confidence in the voice of the so-called "experts".
At this stage the infected horses are all in the mild onset stages. But I thought it incredibly co-incidental that this all could be happening on such a widespread scale, as I would think there is about 40km between/about one and all mentioned in this blog. It begs the question, where else? It is just blowing out exponentially. They will never get a buffer to work at this rate. Fingers crossed for the rest of the country they can.......
Also forgot to mention we do have an infected mare, she lives in the broodmare band at Toft Endurance. Needless to say I haven't been to see her but they assure me she is doing well. Due to foal this next week. And also another dry mare who may or may not be infected as we speak in a paddock next door to Lanamere. These mares have been super endurance horses of the past and produced some super foals. Neither are young, 21 and 24 respectively so hope they are not knocked around inadvertently....
Over and out for tonight the 28th September
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